How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Damon23 on Sun Oct 16, 2016 3:14 pm

I got the carb back from the builder and got everything on and tuned. So I took it down the road and have a nasty vibration/shake from the passenger side front. It comes in at about 60 mph. After swapping the tires around there is no change. I even put on a set of new shocks and that kind of helped but still get the vibration/shake. I checked the tie rod ends by placing my hands at 9 and 3 and got very little movement. Tried again at 12 and 6 and the same amount very little if at all movement. I removed the caliper and it seems to be dragging a little but the rotor moves freely after removing the caliper.

I removed the outer and inner tie rod ends to check those off the car and the ends feel clunky. They move around with some tension but not smooth. The inner one was the worse. How do I check the lower a arm bushings? What do I do and what am I looking for? Also, when I do the bounce test after installing the new shocks the passenger side still has a little bounce to it. The driver side is firm, goes down then up and that's it. The passenger side goes down then moves a little bit to settle. Could a bad spring give me a wobble/vibration/shake?


Last edited by Damon23 on Wed Nov 09, 2016 4:53 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by fasrnur on Sun Oct 16, 2016 5:01 pm

I'm by no way a suspension expert, but it sounds like the tie rods could possibly a cause, if not the cause of your problem. As for the bushings, I would think that you should be able to take a look at them and see if they're cracked and dried out. I'm sure more knowledgeable people will chime in on this for you sir.
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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Hs1973 on Mon Oct 17, 2016 3:42 pm

Im watching this. I also have a vibration at around 50-60 and i cant find out whats causing it. My entire suspension is rebuildt with new bushings, shocks, and so on. It seems to come from passenger side front. And i cant find the culpret. I had the driveshaft rebuildt and ballanced it helped a little, but not enough. So If anybody has any ideas im all ears.
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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by ant7377 on Mon Oct 17, 2016 6:47 pm

If I told you what I've done to get rid of mine you would think I'm nuts,it's still there.
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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by clanceman427 on Mon Oct 17, 2016 6:58 pm

How about idler arm?
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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Damon23 on Mon Oct 17, 2016 7:12 pm

Hs1973 wrote:Im watching this. I also have a vibration at around 50-60 and i cant find out whats causing it. My entire suspension is rebuildt with new bushings, shocks, and so on. It seems to come from passenger side front. And i cant find the culpret. I had the driveshaft rebuildt and ballanced it helped  a little, but not enough. So If anybody has any ideas im all ears.

So far I'm in for a driveshaft balance and ujoints, shocks, rotors and bearings and have had tires balanced and rotated them around in case it was a bent wheel. If you've rebuilt your whole suspension then it does not look good for me. Although everything is tight I went ahead and got new inner and outer tie rod ends for the passenger side. Those were the only thing suspect. I've yet to run it down the road and throw it into neutral to see if it goes away or not. I've been told it could be the torque converter but mine is specifically in the right front. I did pick up a pair of front springs today from a 96 impala ss. Actually the same car the rears came off. I have a gopro, I wonder if I can find a place to mount it under there and see if anything comes up.

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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Damon23 on Mon Oct 17, 2016 7:13 pm

clanceman427 wrote:How about idler arm?  

I'm going to pull that off and check it when I do the springs. It is mounted on the right front and could very well be the culprit. I've read so many blogs, forums and facebook posts over the last couple days but they have either not resolved it or didn't bother to come back and let everyone know what fixed it. I hate that.

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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by ant7377 on Mon Oct 17, 2016 7:14 pm

I've had my friends shadow me on the highway and look- ,nothing to see.
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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by ant7377 on Mon Oct 17, 2016 7:15 pm

You would know if it's the idler are the wheel would not recover after a turn. Maybe you have a tire out of round,defective maybe.
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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by dynchel on Mon Oct 17, 2016 8:14 pm

ant7377 wrote:You would know if it's the idler are the wheel would not recover after a turn. Maybe you have a tire out of round,defective maybe.
The simple test for that would be move the tires around...ie rotate them & see if anything changes.
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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by pila on Mon Oct 17, 2016 8:52 pm

Not a G3, but I had a '84 Buick Regal that did that. 78 K miles since new. I replaced U joints, no better, replaced all the tires, no better. While under the car, I grabbed the drive shaft & shook it a bit...turned out that the problem was the bushing in the trans tail housing was worn enough to get a vibration in the drive shaft, witch initiated a front end vibration.
After telling an old Pontiac mechanic about this, he said it's not that uncommon, and happens occasionally.
So, check how tight/loose the yoke on your drive shaft is, in that tail housing bushing.
It may be easier to replace ( if needed) by removing the tail housing & tapping it out from the inside. That's how I do it, but you would also need a new O ring for the housing....

Some parts stores sell the bushing & seal as a kit bu the way..

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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Damon23 on Mon Oct 17, 2016 9:22 pm

ant7377 wrote:You would know if it's the idler are the wheel would not recover after a turn. Maybe you have a tire out of round,defective maybe.

Even if the joint was just wore and not broken? I've moved the tires around and was even at the tire shop with the guy I bought the set up from. He had them balanced in front of me. Kind of a deal sealer there.

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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Damon23 on Mon Oct 17, 2016 9:23 pm

pila wrote:Not a G3, but I had a '84 Buick Regal that did that. 78 K miles since new. I replaced U joints, no better, replaced all the tires, no better.  While under the car, I grabbed the drive shaft &  shook it a bit...turned out that the problem was the bushing in the trans tail housing was worn enough to get a vibration in the drive shaft, witch initiated a front end vibration.
 After telling an old Pontiac mechanic about this, he said it's not that uncommon, and happens occasionally.
So, check how tight/loose the yoke on your drive shaft is, in that tail housing bushing.
It may be easier to replace ( if needed) by removing the tail housing & tapping it out from the inside.  That's how I do it, but you would also need a new O ring for the housing....

Some parts stores sell the bushing & seal as a kit bu the way..

I did remove the driveshaft but never checked for play, just checked the joints themselves then dropped if off for joints and balance.

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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by ant7377 on Mon Oct 17, 2016 10:10 pm

Damon23 wrote:
ant7377 wrote:You would know if it's the idler are the wheel would not recover after a turn. Maybe you have a tire out of round,defective maybe.

Even if the joint was just wore and not broken? I've moved the tires around and was even at the tire shop with the guy I bought the set up from. He had them balanced in front of me. Kind of a deal sealer there.
I remember when it went bad on my Olds 98 and my dad's Roadmaster. Both times it did the same thing,wheel would not recover after a turn.
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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Damon23 on Tue Oct 18, 2016 8:52 am

No play in the yoke, tailshaft or pinion. After my son took some photos it does look like the drivers side wheel is kind of toe in. I watched a video on how to do a home alignment. After I put in the new springs and tie rod ends this weekend i'll give that a shot and see what happens.

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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by ant7377 on Tue Oct 18, 2016 9:05 am

Check the ball joints too. Jack it right under the lower ball joint so there is a load on it and pry up under the tire .
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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by clanceman427 on Tue Oct 18, 2016 6:33 pm

Make sure the sleeves aren't stripped on the tie rods. Are you replacing the sleeves where the inner and outer tie rods meet?
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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Damon23 on Tue Oct 18, 2016 8:39 pm

I did the ball joint test and they are tight and fine. I did order the sleeve as well. I read a interesting article today about caster and too much positive caster can cause a issue similar to what I have. But I have not found a procedure or video explaining how to check it. It may be a pro thing. It's driving me crazy cause I have to wait until Thursday to mess with it. No one had the outer tie rod. Not even summit, they are about 40 minutes from me.

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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by dynchel on Tue Oct 18, 2016 8:44 pm

Damon23 wrote:I did the ball joint test and they are tight and fine. I did order the sleeve as well. I read a interesting article today about caster and too much positive caster can cause a issue similar to what I have. But I have not found a procedure or video explaining how to check it. It may be a pro thing. It's driving me crazy cause I have to wait until Thursday to mess with it. No one had the outer tie rod. Not even summit, they are about 40 minutes from me.
We're are you at?  I'm in mentor, Ohio (right on lake Erie) & summit is probably a hour away.
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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Damon23 on Tue Oct 18, 2016 9:25 pm

I'm in Douglasville, GA and it's about 40 minutes away. My office however is in Stockbridge which is about 10 miles away. I'll go sometimes on lunch when I'm at the office to check out scratch and dent stuff. Most of the time I can get all my oil change stuff, cleaning supplies cause they carry the oddball products and my general maintenance stuff there instead of dealing with the parts stores.

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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by dynchel on Tue Oct 18, 2016 9:27 pm

Oh, gotcha, I forgot there are more than one summit racing nowadays.
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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Hs1973 on Wed Oct 19, 2016 12:16 pm

Im going to check all suspension components during this winter and replace If anything is even slightly worn. Also im getting some other rims and tires, i know that even If things are new it is not always a garantie that it is as it should be. I party blame my bf Goodrich tires. Even If they are new i have once before had an issue with them Being out of round. I have new american racing alu rims. And they should be ok but im going to try a whole other set of wheels, to see If it does anything. Also i have been told that the bushing that is located in the extension housing of the transmission, can also cause trouble If worn. So im going to change that as Well. Only trouble is i cant actually drive it before spring. Because here in Europe my insurence only permit use from march to october. But im going to find the problem cause it is annoying when driving it.
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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Damon23 on Wed Oct 19, 2016 3:54 pm

Annoying is putting it nicely. New tie rods came today. They only feel a little stiffer than the others so that may not have been the issue. I'll put them on anyway since I have them. I can give the ball joints a better test once I put the new springs in the front. My friend told me since my old ones are wore out I may notice a better ride after that. The car does sit really low in the front and I wondered if they'd been cut to get the ride height, fingers crossed it will level it out. Daytona is only 5 weeks away and hauling it down is a option but a dead last one. I want to drive it. 425 miles with that vibration is not acceptable and neither is driving 55 mph.

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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by chevellelaguna on Wed Oct 19, 2016 5:16 pm

Damon been listening to your issues with the vibration you have. Seems like you're eliminating a lot of suspects things and still not making progress. My two cents are, the vibration wouldn't come from a slightly bad tie rod end, A bad ball joint, or idler arm. Since you've eliminated a rim or tire. You should make sure to eliminate if it's a driveline vibration or something rotational. When you're cruising at 55 and it starts to vibrate continue to accelerate, it may get worse, it may go away, you haven't said what happens at a higher speed ( if it continues, gets worse, or goes away) once at say 75 mph slip the trans into nutral, and come off the gas, is the vibration there at 55, or does it go away?
Wrong alignment specs won't cause a vibration. If you isolate that it isn't there under engine load then it's something that could be bent up front, rotor or spindle, you'd have to check the runout to see if they're in spec.
I've had a bad "droning" issue not so much a vibration in the steering wheel, it ended up being loose bolts on the transmission to the back of the motor in conjunction with a worn trans mount, under cruise at 70 mph it was annoying to drive, if you let off and coasted it would go away as the trans re centered itself. I chased that issue for a year till I finally figured out what it was.
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Re: How do I check the suspension? SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Damon23 on Wed Oct 19, 2016 5:45 pm

I have not yet driven it and thrown it into neutral. That was a after thought to taking the front end apart. The vibration was worse at 55-60 but decreased a little at 70. I had no more room to run that fast for long. It is odd that it feels specifically in the right front of the car but I've read where a mount or tail shaft bushing can also cause this issue. The Trans was rebuilt right before I got it so who knows if it was a amateur rebuild or they bought a use one cleaned and painted it. The driveshaft has no play and unions are good and lubed and the driveshaft was balanced. I'll also check the Trans mount when I do the springs.

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