Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

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Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by Olof on Tue May 22, 2018 4:44 am

Hi

We have a 1973 El Camino 454 SS, the car is originally sold in Sweden and we got at least one of the original wheels the SS steering wheel etc we feel pretty sure it was an SS from the factory. The car is however not a car anymore but a tractor Smile. Yes no kidding in Sweden you can as a youth drive a tractor max 20mph between the age of 15 and 18 (which is the age of one of my sons) before you can drive a car. Hence cars gets converted to "tractor".

We were not the ones converting it and it's not very pretty made since the 454 got ditched and replaced by a 4cyl Mercedes diesel - yes don't laugh fuel is is $8 per gallon all the satisfy the CO2 maffia and the tax man. The diesel will go the day the tractor returns to car status. The car is super simple no options what so ever beside SS, it's crank windows and no AC, no PW or swivel seats or anything, only power steering and brakes. The dash has a fuel gauge when you would expect to find a tach, and yes there is "four" gauges but not not gauges but dummy lights I guess because the only the "GEN" light is kinda left the rest is "chopped" by PO's that wanted to fit instruments in the holes. So dumb question but what is actually supposed to be in the "instruments" i.e. what dummy lights or possible instruments should be there?

Yes if anyone has one instrument bezel for sale we would be interested since it would be nice to get it back to original state without spending week doing plastic welding and crafting.

Cheers Olof

PS: We are in need of bits and boobs from the rear area of the interior, as well as the sheet metal of the front cargo wall (i.e. the wall behind the seats). Some PO were kind enough to cut it all out to put in a gigantic bass boombox there which eats into the pickup bed.




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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by Mcarlo77 on Tue May 22, 2018 9:21 am

[quote="Olof"]Hi
PS: We are in need of bits and boobs...

Ha...who among us isn't?!!  Just kidding with 'ya!  Welcome to the site.  And, that poor El Camino...turned into a tractor of all things.  I'd like to see a pic of that.  

Anyway, you are asking about the round gauges.  They came with two different setups...those with actual gauges and those with idiot lights.  What you appear to have is more commonly found on Monte Carlos with the idiot lights instead of actual gauges...but, I've seen them on Chevelle SS's, also.  For your info, from left to right, they are Oil, Temp, large Fuel gauge, Speedo, Gen and Clock.  

If your instrument bezel is all hacked up, I probably have an extra I could sell you.  If you could be more specific on the other stuff you need for the rear of the cabin area, I'm sure someone on here can help.


Last edited by Mcarlo77 on Tue May 22, 2018 3:00 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by thatfnthing on Tue May 22, 2018 9:33 am

Welcome! Post some photos when you can -- I for one would be interested in seeing an El Camino "tractor". I would also be tempted to leave the Mercedes diesel in there just because it's so different.

And I, too, am in need of bits and boobs. Smile
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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by Olof on Tue May 22, 2018 10:35 am

Hi Folks,

Thanks for the welcome, and hehe yes bits and boobs, well the later is nice indeed, but I have to defend my horrible typo on my dyslexia and of course it's bits and bobs I'm referring too, it's a shame the spell checker doesn't catch when you write boobs instead of bobs.

The tractor is looking just like a normal El Camino you will not see that it is one bar the big slow moving warning triangle in back. The bed is partially covered to create a smaller bed this is due to regulatory things when the car is converted to tractor. It's benz diesel also mated to two gear boxes one after the other (yes horrible) but that is also regulation all to make a powerful puller that only can make max 20 mph in highest gear. Normally it's volvo and other more common cars that are converted and then you will need to  chop it totally up so there is no back seat area at all. Like below:



Since this is kind of already taken care of with the El Camino you only need to make the bed smaller to meet the max loading area as per regulations.

In re to parts, Yes our bezel is is more than hacked up. I think I will do a proper list of stuff we are in need of this evening local time. I will also ask wifey if she can provide you guys with the boobs but I doubt she will be willing to part with it Very Happy

Cheers Olof

Will try to snap a pic later at the moment it's not much to see to be honest, it's just a white painted (non original) Camino in half pulled apart state in order to sort out the worst hacks by probably 20 PO - worst is the electrical.

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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by Olof on Wed May 23, 2018 3:16 am

Hi Folks,

Update, so sorted the diesel engine electrical wiring not that that is overly complicated but need some M12-1.5  to NPT adapters so I can use normal US type temp and oil pressure sensors. Need to wire up the vacuum actuated shutoff valve which was done semi manualy by the PO.

Few questions in re to electric:


As you can see here, the wiring to the heater fan. The three prong connector is to the heater speed resistors and the round is as you might know to the heater fan it self. However if comparing to El Camino Central's wiring schematics the colors doesn't match at all. But where is the two prong supposed to be connected? The green wire was hooked up as "ignition feed" to the glow plug relay.



I'm fairly sure this is the horn relay but would be nice with confirmation and is it the original one? I'm pretty sure the the red circled connectors are
for the horn. Black is relay signal cable from horn button and green is relayed powered cable to the horn themself. But the orange circled round connectors are mystery Smile.  Notice how nicely holes been made in the firewall, it's all so neatly done, not. It all need to be fixed of course you can't have it like that is horrible.  



Again cut cables and harness dangling not connected to anything. What was this to originally maybe the round connector circled in yellow can give us a clue? (and yes I've ordered the service manual, will take some time to arrive though).



Even more cut here, the big wire is going down to the starter and the purple is for the solenoid. I'm guessing the rather large cables are the feed from the alternator but would like some confirmation on this. They are just cut not leading anywhere at the moment (well attached to the plus side of the horn relay hence me thinking from alternator).



Here is the car itself Smile as I said nothing special, yes the wheels will be changed to at the moment BMW with studded winter tires. We have some period slot mags that will look good we think. We don't have a full setup of turbine wheels and no hubcaps to them at all sorry to say. We are missing the grill and grill extensions so we look to buy that. Moldings are ok but not good but we can suffice and repair unless again someone has some for sale. We miss the wheel arch moldings are we are searching for that since it's a part of the SS package.



Here is the guttered instrument bit, I guess we could salvage and put in gauges in a nice and neat way not guttered like this but best would be to get either dummy light or real instrument bezel and instrument portion of all of this.



The dash it self is in really good nick though not a single crack Smile, well I might be blind too but not seen one yet.



Ah yes would be nice with a tank, yes the tank can be bought new but the straps can't and they are gone. Anyone wanting to sell a a nice tank and straps and all?



The bas boombox we rather be without but we need someone that can sell us the sheet metal that been cut out.


In plastic covers in the back we got the lower rear door (B) pillar cover, the rear tray (metal stamped and can be viewed in the boombox picture). However the rear door (B) pillar upper cover is badly cut out as seen in pic and we really need new ones if possible. The plastic cover above the rear windshield is gone and we need this one too. I kind of guess there must be some additional panels or something covering the rear "firewall" itself but what, looking around it look carpeted just with a plastic rim around the tool/jack "pocket". Maybe someone can give some more insight here.  It's a 71 VistaCruiser in poor state that is serving as temporary storage area Smile

 
Ah yes we will need to fix the floor too its' just flat sheet metal, we have a floor from a 77 Cutlass that could come handy, we will get a firewall from the same car too since our cowl is pretty badly rusted. That repair will not be done now but first to the winter or so.  



Cheers O

PS: Anyone selling a pair of swivel chairs and a center console for a stick shift Very Happy, at the moment its a bench seat out of an unknown car.

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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by thatfnthing on Wed May 23, 2018 9:25 am

Well, to start, here are your wiring diagrams:

http://www.g3gm.com/t296-wiring-schematics-needed (scroll down about half way)

If you need larger versions, PM me with your email address and I can send them to you.

First thing, though is to decide if saving the original harness is even worth it.  If it's a total hatchet job, you might be better off getting a new harness from somewhere like Painless Performance.  It might be more cost effective.

If you definitely want to save it, be prepared for a fair amount of work, testing, soldering, and tracking down terminals, connectors and wire with the stock colors.  You will also have to document everything you did so you remember what's what in a year when you need to change or investigate something. I like a good puzzle, so I'm happy to help, but it will be a process. Smile

Photo #1: There's more than one 3 terminal connector in that neighborhood if the car originally had A/C. Best way to identify is not by the connector so much as the wire colors. What do you have there? Where does the other end of the green wire go?

Photo #2: The horn relay looks original, and I think you're right on the green and black wires. Can you post a better shot of the other two wires? What colors are they? If one is tan, it's probably the brake light trigger from the proportioning valve on the frame.

Photo #3: Can you post a close up of those? Are we in the front left of the engine bay?

Photo #4: Same -- can we we get a close up and the wire colors? Can't quite make them out through the dirt. Wink


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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by g3chevy on Wed May 23, 2018 10:07 am

Welcome to the forum Olof! What a great story behind your El Camino. Look forward to seeing the progress as you work towards getting it back to its original state. I may have a pair of gas tank straps that will work from a 74 El Camino I recently parted out. I'll dig them out of my stash and take pictures for you to review.
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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by Mcarlo77 on Wed May 23, 2018 10:49 am

The crack-free dash is worth it's weight in gold! And, from what I can see, your dash instrument panel bezel looks to be intact (can't see the radio opening, though). Is it the cluster housing behind the bezel that is hacked up? I've got gauge clusters (with actual gauges & tach).

You are going to find it very difficult to find someone who will ship a used gas tank. Shipping companies won't accept anything that smells of fuel. If someone doesn't have the tank straps laying around, I could probably find a pair at the junk yard. I could probably hook you up with some swivel buckets from there, too. I've got a floor console and shifter...just not the "correct" shifter knob for a '73 (they were a little larger than the '74-'77).

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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by Olof on Wed May 23, 2018 11:05 am

thatfnthing wrote:Well, to start, here are your wiring diagrams:

http://www.g3gm.com/t296-wiring-schematics-needed (scroll down about half way)

If you need larger versions, PM me with your email address and I can send them to you.


Thanks for all info I also sent PM so please let me know if you got it since apparently new members can't send email address so had to make that one with DOT and AT and such. So please let me know if sent.



thatfnthing wrote:
First thing, though is to decide if saving the original harness is even worth it.  If it's a total hatchet job, you might be better off getting a new harness

stock colors.  You will also have to document everything you did so you remember what's what in a year when you need to change or investigate something. I like a good puzzle, so I'm happy to help, but it will be a process. Smile

Well will just extend the original harness back and fix terminals and such. Yes big puzzle hence why I post.

thatfnthing wrote:
Photo #1: There's more than one 3 terminal connector in that neighborhood if the car originally had A/C.  Best way to identify is not by the connector so much as the wire colors.  What do you have there?  Where does the other end of the green wire go?

There is only one three prong connector, I doubt very much the car had A/C -- it was considered way to fancy in Sweden back then. The other end of the green wire went to the glow plug relay for the diesel. Someone used it as "ignition feed" for the relay.



thatfnthing wrote:
Photo #2: The horn relay looks original, and I think you're right on the green and black wires.  Can you post a better shot of the other two wires?  What colors are they?  If one is tan, it's probably the brake light trigger from the proportioning valve on the frame.

Ah yes very sure your right about the tan being for the brake proportional valve. Will try to look more at our other GM cars for more clues too. The thing was the 77 Cutlass didn't look exactly the same in this area.

thatfnthing wrote:
Photo #3: Can you post a close up of those?  Are we in the front left of the engine bay?  

Photo #4: Same -- can we we get a close up and the wire colors?  Can't quite make them out through the dirt.  Wink

Yes both pics are from the left side. The three prong connector is from the right side of engine bay. Will take closeups later today hopefully.

Cheers O



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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by Olof on Wed May 23, 2018 11:08 am

g3chevy wrote:Welcome to the forum Olof! What a great story behind your El Camino. Look forward to seeing the progress as you work towards getting it back to its original state. I may have a pair of gas tank straps that will work from a 74 El Camino I recently parted out. I'll dig them out of my stash and take pictures for you to review.

Ah yes thanks g3chevy that would be very nice, lets see what other members can help with too as you want to send all stuff in one consolidated shippment from the US to Europe or you will get killed in freight costs.

Cheers O

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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by Olof on Wed May 23, 2018 11:15 am

Mcarlo77 wrote:The crack-free dash is worth it's weight in gold!  And, from what I can see, your dash instrument panel bezel looks to be intact (can't see the radio opening, though).  Is it the cluster housing behind the bezel that is hacked up?  I've got gauge clusters (with actual gauges & tach).

Thanks M77, yes very happy for my gold Smile... Yes the cluster housing is hacked up, but so is the bezel too, kinda hard but the holes been enlarged and the rear lips been removed all so you can "fit" 52mm standard VDO type of gauges. A gauge cluster would of course be of great interest depending on how much gold I need part with Smile.

Mcarlo77 wrote:
You are going to find it very difficult to find someone who will ship a used gas tank.  Shipping companies won't accept anything that smells of fuel.  If someone doesn't have the tank straps laying around, I could probably find a pair at the junk yard.  I could probably hook you up with some swivel buckets from there, too.  I've got a floor console and shifter...just not the "correct" shifter knob for a '73 (they were a little larger than the '74-'77).

You're right it might be so now, been buying second hand tanks from Arizona before and had them sent over but things change I guess or they were smell free lol. The swivels, and console and such is also of great interest again depending on the gold. Maybe you can PM with pics and prices. As said before looking to get all parts together so I can consolidate shipping or it will be very expensive indeed.

Big thanks in adv for all the parts ideas Smile

Cheers O


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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by thatfnthing on Wed May 23, 2018 11:31 am

Olof wrote:
thatfnthing wrote:
Photo #1: There's more than one 3 terminal connector in that neighborhood if the car originally had A/C.  Best way to identify is not by the connector so much as the wire colors.  What do you have there?  Where does the other end of the green wire go?
There is only one three prong connector, I doubt very much the car had A/C -- it was considered way to fancy in Sweden back then. The other end of the green wire went to the glow plug relay for the diesel.  Someone used it as "ignition feed" for the relay.

Okay, then that's the feed to the engine thermo switch, which was used to turn the heater fan on low when the engine reached operating temperature.  It was obviously not intended to be a power feed for anything like glow plugs.  The three prong plug is indeed for the heater fan resistor pack (runs back to your fan speed switch in the dash) and the colors should be: black with double-yellow stripe, black with double orange stripe, and black with double blue stripe.

The black with double yellow stripe is also the feed for the thermo switch, so the glow plugs are being fed by the same circuit that feeds your heater fan switch. I don't know what glow plugs draw, but I would have thought it would be more than enough to blow the heater fuse when wired this way... scratch
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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by Olof on Wed May 23, 2018 12:20 pm

Wrote all this before I saw your new post.. since i had a cached page in my browser Very Happy

----

thatfnthing wrote:
Photo #1: There's more than one 3 terminal connector in that neighborhood if the car originally had A/C.  Best way to identify is not by the connector so much as the wire colors.  What do you have there?  Where does the other end of the green wire go?

So this is:

3 prong - heater resistors
1 prong round - heater fan
2 prong - engine thermal switch

I guess the thermal switch is to that the heater fan comes on first when the engine actually is warm right?

thatfnthing wrote:
Photo #2: The horn relay looks original, and I think you're right on the green and black wires.  Can you post a better shot of the other two wires?  What colors are they?  If one is tan, it's probably the brake light trigger from the proportioning valve on the frame.

Tan is indeed the brake
Round black is underhood light, what you see is actually the fuse holder, well one part of it.
The green and other black is for horn.

Will be able to solve the others when I get high res pictures so hard to read the small images but made me solve the first problems Smile so big thanks for those better small than nothing Smile

Cheers Olof

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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by Olof on Wed May 23, 2018 12:23 pm

Super thanks clarifies the function of the thermo switch. Super thanks for the bigger images now back to the garage Smile

Cheers O

thatfnthing wrote:
Olof wrote:
thatfnthing wrote:
Photo #1: There's more than one 3 terminal connector in that neighborhood if the car originally had A/C.  Best way to identify is not by the connector so much as the wire colors.  What do you have there?  Where does the other end of the green wire go?
There is only one three prong connector, I doubt very much the car had A/C -- it was considered way to fancy in Sweden back then. The other end of the green wire went to the glow plug relay for the diesel.  Someone used it as "ignition feed" for the relay.

Okay, then that's the feed to the engine thermo switch, which was used to turn the heater fan on low when the engine reached operating temperature.  It was obviously not intended to be a power feed for anything like glow plugs.  The three prong plug is indeed for the heater fan resistor pack (runs back to your fan speed switch in the dash) and the colors should be: black with double-yellow stripe, black with double orange stripe, and black with double blue stripe.

The black with double yellow stripe is also the feed for the thermo switch, so the glow plugs are being fed by the same circuit that feeds your heater fan switch.  I don't know what glow plugs draw, but I would have thought it would be more than enough to blow the heater fuse when wired this way... scratch


Last edited by Olof on Wed May 23, 2018 12:27 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by thatfnthing on Wed May 23, 2018 12:23 pm

Olof wrote:Yes the cluster housing is hacked up, but so is the bezel too, kinda hard but the holes been enlarged and the rear lips been removed all so you can "fit" 52mm standard VDO type of gauges. A gauge cluster would of course be of great interest depending on how much gold I need part with Smile.

Then one of the PO didn't bother to do it right, because I have those exact gauges in my dash, and they fit fine if you remove the trim ring and glass face. There's no need to hack up the dash face.
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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by Olof on Wed May 23, 2018 1:31 pm

Hi Folks,

Managed to sort out what all cut off and disconnected cables are for under the hood with help of the wiring diagram provided by thatfnthing. Hats off for the diagrams, printed them on double papers so big and nice and then it was a breeze to figure it all out, so I'm happy as a pig in a poke Very Happy.

Now on to the cables under the dash which is just as bad.. lol Well hopefully end of week we have a functional electrical system that is somewhat original and hooked up to a mercedes diesel.

Cheers O

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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by thatfnthing on Wed May 23, 2018 1:51 pm

Thumbs up
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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by g3chevy on Thu May 24, 2018 11:49 pm

Here are the gas tank straps I have from a 74 El Camino.



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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

Post by Olof on Sun May 27, 2018 5:38 pm

g3chevy wrote:Here are the gas tank straps I have from a 74 El Camino.

Super thanks sent PM Smile

Cheers Olof

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Re: Hello From Sweden -- 73 El Camino SS

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