Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by dynchel on Wed Apr 30, 2014 6:20 pm

Yeah, on fast and loud they found out the hard way about using cheap oil for break in.
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by 77mali on Wed Apr 30, 2014 6:35 pm

driveit wrote:What about this cam.  Probably won't get it right now, but a little down the road.
http://www.compperformancegroupstores.com/store/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=CC&Product_Code=12-210-2&Category_Code=

Also I normally use Castrol in my motors, but have no idea what to use for break in oil.  Years ago we just used plain cheap oil, which I have found was a bad idea.  Any recommendations?

I'm using that cam in the "XE" version, it's 'Mild".  If you have a 40 overbore you might consider something a bit beefier if you want it to crank out more than 348 horses, which is what that cam will produce or close to.  It is a good cam for torque.  It also depends on your heads- are you using vortec heads?  Call Comp and get a recommendation as to what your options might be.  You'll need to get them the specs on the heads, the motor's piston's & crank-shaft (bore & stroke), torque converter, transmission & rear end gear ratio's.

As far as oil- Comp has a break-in oil, as does Joe Gibbs, called "BR" for the initial break-in.  If you "upgrade" to a Hydraulic Roller valve train, you can skip the break-in process altogether.  More money & a bit more difficult initially but better in the long run, I wish I had done that in retrospect.  I plan to use a 5W-30 oil & add ZDDP to it at every oil change, if I ever get the motor back in the car.
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by Joe73 on Wed Apr 30, 2014 7:10 pm

I've been researching the oil situation for flat tappets. What I'm mostly seeing is that we need AT LEAST 1200-1300 PPM of zinc to keep out cams and lifter happy. Obviously, the more the better. Looks like all the high end oils like Gibbs have the content we need. Also looks like Delo 400 (diesel oil) has the numbers we need. Also from what I've read, any zinc additives do not mix well with factory additive packages and actually more harm than good.
Lots of reading out there to do before you choose. I'm just leaning towards using Gibbs oil. For the extra cost of the change, probably once a year, I think better safe than sorry.
Break in procedure is CRITICAL for a flat tappet cam.
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by bracketchev1221 on Wed Apr 30, 2014 9:56 pm

I agree on at least the xtreme energy comp cams. They are a big improvement over the old high energy cams. And like was said zddp in the oil is important. I use the rotella diesel oil in both the nova and chevelle.
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by pila on Wed Apr 30, 2014 11:47 pm

I used the Comp Cams additive in 10W30 oil for break in, in my Elco. Then drained it, cut the filter apart with my filter cutter, to see if there were any chunks of metal in it Very Happy 
I have Valvoline VR1 racing oil in it now, as well as in my Malibu.
I used the 268 magnum cam back in the 80s, in a 400 SBC. fairly mild in a 400. Probably more lumpy in a smaller engine.....

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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by driveit on Thu May 01, 2014 11:54 am

Thanks for all of the tips.

So last night I went out to check out the parts from my old motor. The crank had a spun bearing and all of the journals on the crank were scatched. This crank only had around 2000 miles on it before the piston failed and cracked the block on the #7 cylinder. I called the local machin shop and they said it would be at least 100$ to fix it. This was a new Scat crank. Sad

Anyway. Not rebuilding the engine now. I don't have the cash to fix the crank and the other one I had was worse. So, for now I think I will just try and do a cam swap on my current engine to see if that will fix my problems temporarily.

I am having trouble with verifying what this cam is. I bought it in a kit from Northern Auto Parts. I believe that it was a Crane Energizer Cam, but not sure. Done some looking around online and they say that it could be a Cam Dynamics Cam that was distributed after Crane bought the company out. Here are the only numbers I could find on it.

11-41-02
CD10007B
H2

I just want to find out what it is and whether it would be ok to put in my stock motor. I know it would be better with a dual plane, but only have the Weiand single for now.

Please help.
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by Joe73 on Thu May 01, 2014 12:05 pm

This looks like it.

You guys are right on the money on that cam. I am pretty sure that Crane has this Cam dynamics old grind under part # 100072 with the 2 indicating it is a cam and lifter set so the 10007 is the cam #. Specs on this cam are 228-228 @.050 .480-.480 112 LSA. Valve timing is 7-41-51-(3). Crane says 9.5-11.0 cr advised, 3400-3800 cruise rpm. Not the best cam to use in a mild 350 with the intake valve closing at 41 ABDC. This is a mid to upper range rpm cam so plan accordingly. Comp 268, Energizer 272H10, Isky 264 Mega cam for a fairly stock 350.
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by driveit on Thu May 01, 2014 12:12 pm

I found that too. Just wasn't sure about it. I found this on the Crane page.
Good mid range to upper RPM torque and HP, fair idle,
moderate performance usage, good mid range HP, 3400-
3800 cruise RPM, 9.5 to 11.0 compression ratio advised.
Energizer 2800-6200
10007 228 @.050, 284 Duration 112 7 41 .000 .480
284 H12 100072*b 99377-16d 228 284 51 (3) .000 .480
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by driveit on Thu May 01, 2014 12:16 pm

Do you think this cam would be worth putting in?
350 SBC stock block
Stock 882 heads
Weiand single plane intake
Edelbrock 600 CFM Carb.
Headers
Accel HEI Supercoil

350TH transmission with no stall

2:73 rear gears

This would be mainly a daily driver. I really want a good performance sound.
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by Joe73 on Thu May 01, 2014 1:09 pm

Power band starts at 2800 rpm. Not too good.for a daily driver. And if dont have compression to match you will be shy on your vaccuum for the power brakes.
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by driveit on Thu May 01, 2014 1:16 pm

How would that one idle do you think?
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by Joe73 on Thu May 01, 2014 1:28 pm

It says.fair.idle.  So it should.sound nice and choppy.  You will most likely need a torque convertor for it as well. Just dont forget, if.you dont match your parts you wont be happy with performance or mileage for that matter.  For a daily driver Id stay at about a 268 duration max.  But more importantly keep the rpm range starting around 1500. Match your parts for what you want to do.
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by driveit on Thu May 01, 2014 1:30 pm

It is either that or an old stock cam if I can find one. Do think that it would go well with the single plan intake or is it the heads that would be holding it back? I am sorry for all of the questions. Still learning!
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by chevellelaguna on Thu May 01, 2014 2:13 pm

You're right about the heads being the limiting factor for that cam as well as too low compression. You'll end up in coil bind with 480 lift and be pulling the rocker studs. Constantly have to adjust the lash, till you bend pushrods or break rocker studs. Not a good choice for a cam. You unfortunately can't have a healthy sounding cam with an underperforming stock engine.
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by driveit on Thu May 01, 2014 2:23 pm

Do you think that cam could be what cased my last engine to blow? it was 30 over with double hump heads, performer intake. The heads were the small valve version.
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by bracketchev1221 on Thu May 01, 2014 2:35 pm

What happened to the parts from the old engine? I would be using the double hump heads and the performer intake.
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by driveit on Thu May 01, 2014 2:38 pm

intake was stolen along with about 800$ or so of other tools and parts. Heads I think are bad.
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by chevellelaguna on Thu May 01, 2014 4:43 pm

"Think"....or know for sure? Cracked? Warped? Burned/bent valves? Chances are all of the above, at least need a valve job/ milled and seals.
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by driveit on Thu May 01, 2014 11:16 pm

Not positive. I just don't have the cash to have them checked out.
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by chevellelaguna on Fri May 02, 2014 8:02 am

If that's the case then I would use the 882 castings, and get by with a lower lift lower duration cam. Somewhere in the lower .400" lift. I had a small block with an RV type cam in it, and smaller chamber and valve heads....forget the casting numbers, would have to check (smog era head, same as your 882) 624! I remember... That motor pulled really nice, had some great torque, can still do it with minimal money, and the parts you already have on hand. Then, save up for a better motor combination. Just remember, the more you try to push out of a stock motor, the more parts you'll break, it'll be unreliable and costly!
Hang onto those double hump heads, they will partially fund some of your next real engine build!!
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by driveit on Fri May 02, 2014 11:40 am

Thanks for the tips. We found another motor. It has a weird stamped set of numbers on the front passenger side of the block. Right in front of the head. I don't have it with me or I would post it. It is in an 86 olds, but it came out of a blazer or truck we thing. It was painted green at some point and we think that it may have been rebuilt. We have 35$ in the car.

We worked most of the evening yesterday trying to get it ready to start. The oil had a bit of water in it so we are going to change the oil before we try to start it. We got everything ready except for changing the oil. We were going to do that as well, but could not get the filter off. We tried three wrenches and they were either slipping or bending the filter. We called it quits for the night. My uncle who was helping me will be working on it today. I hope that when I call him on my lunch he will tell me it is running. I may pull it, clean and paint it then call it done for now and begin a slow more planned out build and rebuild my current engine.

Waiting very impatiently... Wish I was off today!
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by Joe73 on Fri May 02, 2014 12:02 pm

Compression test after you get it running. Then 2 tablespoons oil into each cylinder and compression test again. If the psi comes up, it needs rings.
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by driveit on Fri May 02, 2014 12:31 pm

Joe73 wrote:Compression test after you get it running.  Then 2 tablespoons oil into each cylinder and compression test again.  If the psi comes up, it needs rings.

How do you do that? Do you put it through the spark plug hole?
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by chevellelaguna on Fri May 02, 2014 12:34 pm

Yup they the spark plug hole, use an old school oil squirter can
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Re: Are there any drag racers here and is a performance forum a good idea?

Post by Joe73 on Fri May 02, 2014 1:05 pm

chevellelaguna wrote:Yup they the spark plug hole, use an old school oil squirter can

Exactly!
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