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1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build

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Limey SE
g3chevy / Mr Pontiac
Mob City Pontiac
77camino
impalamonte
Iggy
73ss
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1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build Empty 1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build

Post by g3chevy / Mr Pontiac Mon Jun 28, 2021 10:42 pm

Finally uploaded some videos of the "Twins" that arrived Saturday afternoon. Trying to do my best to document the restoration of one of these cars. The other was determined to be a parts car thanks to the wisdom of Revin Kevin. He was a huge help Saturday unloading these cars as well as my oldest son that we volunteered to steer the first one coming off the transport. Kevin and I spent most of the afternoon going through both cars but we spent most of the time on the Sky Roof car since that's the one we decided to save. We really couldn't do a full inspection on the parts car since we were unable to get the hood open on Saturday. So we focused on the other and did all the normal stuff to try and start it after 20+ years. Pulled the plugs, squirted oil in the cylinders, disconnected the fuel supply line and stuck it in some fresh gas. Had to modify the battery cables to get the starter to crank, but with a little coaxing we got it to fire off. It was a bit noisy at first and then we realized the alternator was locked and the water pump bearings were toast. So knowing that, we ran it again for a few minutes and it ran pretty darn good for being in hibernation for so long. At that point we were pretty tired and decided to call it a day. Just gotta say thank you to Kevin for all his help and sharing his knowledge. So Sunday I spent a little more time with the parts car. Spent about an hour working the rusted hood latch loose so I could inspect the engine bay and engine. Needless to say, I think the engine is locked on this one since the previous owner took off the carb to have it rebuilt and didn't properly cover the intake manifold. There is literally moss growing inside the intake. Hopefully its a good core. We'll find out this fall when we pull it and tear it down. After documenting everything I could on that car, I spent the remainder of the day on the one I'm saving. Played more with the electrical stuff to see what works and what needs attention. I'm sure most of the electrical connections are corroded with all the moisture its been exposed to. The rest of the day was taking notes and video to get a game plan for the restoration. Below are some pics as well as videos Kevin and I took over the weekend. Hope you enjoy and look forward to comments and advice on this build.



Transport Company Arriving To Load Up Can Ams In Pennsylvania
1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build Resize15
1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build Resize14




Day Of Arrival In Houston
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k-mt7OF7ML0
1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build 77_can10
1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build 77_can11




First Start Up
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHSjiFUdiMs




Full Overview
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUfgglpabJI
1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build Img_2014
1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build Img_2013
1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build Img_2015





1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build Img_2016
1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build 20210614
1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build 77_can12




Part Car
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rRyHAx-3ys&t=11s

1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build 77_cam11
1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build 77_cam10
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Post by Limey SE Mon Jun 28, 2021 11:43 pm

MAN I CAN NOT WAIT TO SEE progress on these I am glad they will be used now I have been seeing them for Sale on the FB groups for a very LONG TIME

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Post by 73ss Tue Jun 29, 2021 8:39 am

Looking at that air cleaner, Is the shaker actually open? I had read where those were sealed due to noise. What they call noise, I call music. Nothing beats the sound of the Q-jet war cry.
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Post by Iggy Tue Jun 29, 2021 9:27 am

Check you block casting numbers, they should be 481988XX for a 6.6T/A, the other castings from that time period that end in 557 are "light weight" castings and Pontiac discovered quick they did not stand up to the 220 HP rating of the 6.6T/A so they went back to the mid-1970's heavier casting (481988) and added an XX to the casting number to make it easier for the assembly line to see what engines went into the 6.6 T/A cars.

This should be a decent project, like the Trans Am's of the day, these were the last of the true Muscle Cars!
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Post by g3chevy / Mr Pontiac Tue Jun 29, 2021 9:46 am

Limey SE wrote:MAN I CAN NOT WAIT TO SEE progress on these I am glad they will be used now I have been seeing them for Sale on the FB groups for a very LONG TIME

Thanks Limey! I've been all over the webbernet researching whatever I can find about these cars. If you know a good FB group to find info/parts please let me know. I'm looking for sheet metal in particular.
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Post by g3chevy / Mr Pontiac Tue Jun 29, 2021 9:50 am

73ss wrote:Looking at that air cleaner, Is the shaker actually open? I had read where those were sealed due to noise. What they call noise, I call music. Nothing beats the sound of the Q-jet war cry.

Hey 73ss, the shaker is not open on this one. I've read that these Can Am shakers are actually from the 76 model year Trans Ams. So one article I read stated that this shaker is very similar to the 70-72 shakers that are functional and these can easily be upgraded to be functional. You'll never guess what I've added to my wish list for this car lol.
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Post by g3chevy / Mr Pontiac Tue Jun 29, 2021 9:58 am

Iggy wrote:Check you block casting numbers, they should be 481988XX for a 6.6T/A, the other castings from that time period that end in 557 are "light weight" castings and Pontiac discovered quick they did not stand up to the 220 HP rating of the 6.6T/A so they went back to the mid-1970's heavier casting (481988) and added an XX to the casting number to make it easier for the assembly line to see what engines went into the 6.6 T/A cars.

This should be a decent project, like the Trans Am's of the day, these were the last of the true Muscle Cars!

Thanks for the info Iggy! I'll check the block number and heads and let you know what I find. There is only 79k miles on this car so I'm guessing its the original block. Do you know where I can find the VIN on this block? Also, do you have any idea how to decipher the axle code on these? I've not been able to find any info on that either. The code is 6 AAO 153. Here's a pic.

1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build 77_can13
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Post by Limey SE Tue Jun 29, 2021 10:51 am

g3chevy wrote:
Limey SE wrote:MAN I CAN NOT WAIT TO SEE progress on these I am glad they will be used now I have been seeing them for Sale on the FB groups for a very LONG TIME

Thanks Limey! I've been all over the webbernet researching whatever I can find about these cars. If you know a good FB group to find info/parts please let me know. I'm looking for sheet metal in particular.

Well you know I might know a few LOL Theres more but these are the Main ones

https://www.facebook.com/groups/77PontiacCanAm

https://www.facebook.com/groups/594365340902209

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1531330100291482

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Post by Limey SE Tue Jun 29, 2021 11:00 am

JUST FOR THAT IN CASE you want a head turner in that Can Am chuckle chuckle I know this person

74 455 .030 has 670 heads. ARP studs upper and lower. Pete Jackson Gear Drive. Comp cam solid lifters roller tip rockers. H beam rods. MSD crank trigger with MSD phased distributor,MSD Ignition wires and MSD digital box. Milodon oil pan and oil pump. Pick up only or you set up all the shipping. $4500. OBO60081 Illinois.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/77PontiacCanAm/permalink/10159791650869947/?sale_post_id=10159791650869947

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Post by Limey SE Tue Jun 29, 2021 11:02 am

The Cam thats in it

1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build 202046614_10219908919493411_3348195915058075408_n.jpg?_nc_cat=109&ccb=1-3&_nc_sid=b9115d&_nc_ohc=-wKT_QaHMLMAX8KE-4q&_nc_ht=scontent-ort2-2

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Post by g3chevy / Mr Pontiac Tue Jun 29, 2021 11:37 am

Awesome, thanks Limey!
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Post by impalamonte Tue Jun 29, 2021 12:43 pm

Enjoying the YouTubes!!
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Post by Iggy Tue Jun 29, 2021 1:50 pm

1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build Pontia10

Engine code is same place as Chevy block engine codes, The VIN is vertical on the passenger front of the block. Not sure on the axle code, check out Wallace Racing, they may have that info http://wallaceracing.com/index.html
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Post by Iggy Tue Jun 29, 2021 2:06 pm

The 1970-1972 shaker units had a solenoid that opened the flap when the gas pedal was pushed down, same switch used for a TH400 kickdown. GM had to stop using Cowl Induction, Ram Air and such for model year 1973 noise requirements, a functional shaker is worth 20 HP.

Something else to consider, Pontiac's do not respond as well to modern cams as well as Chevy's do, mainly because modern cams are designed around Chevy's and adapted to Pontiac and Buicks. The lifter valley is on the weak side for roller cams - not a lot of lifter support. Pontiac cast iron intakes actually flow better than a Pontiac Edelbrock Performer. Ram Air Restorations make some very nice cast iron factory type headers - there Long Branch manifolds flow almost as well as headers - 1-hp short!
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Post by 77camino Tue Jun 29, 2021 4:42 pm

G3gm, it’s great that you are going to save one of them. It’s a shame that they ever got in that condition because those were all ready being collected in the 80’s. In the mid 80’s I used to run into a guy at KC car shows that had collected several of them. Im sure that one of them was a trailer queen, but he had others that he would drive. I think he even started a registry, but unfortunately I have not seen him in years. Good luck and will look forward to seeing your progress.
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Post by g3chevy / Mr Pontiac Tue Jun 29, 2021 11:02 pm

impalamonte wrote:Enjoying the YouTubes!!

Thanks Impalamonte! I'll keep posted them as we get things done on it.
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Post by g3chevy / Mr Pontiac Tue Jun 29, 2021 11:05 pm

Iggy wrote:The 1970-1972 shaker units had a solenoid that opened the flap when the gas pedal was pushed down, same switch used for a TH400 kickdown.  GM had to stop using Cowl Induction, Ram Air and such for model year 1973 noise requirements, a functional shaker is worth 20 HP.

Something else to consider, Pontiac's do not respond as well to modern cams as well as Chevy's do, mainly because modern cams are designed around Chevy's and adapted to Pontiac and Buicks.  The lifter valley is on the weak side for roller cams - not a lot of lifter support.  Pontiac cast iron intakes actually flow better than a Pontiac Edelbrock Performer.  Ram Air Restorations make some very nice cast iron factory type headers - there Long Branch manifolds flow almost as well as headers - 1-hp short!

Awesome info Iggy! I'll look over the engine early next week and see what numbers I find. In the meantime I'll start locating the hardware I'll need to the shaker upgrade.
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Post by Limey SE Tue Jun 29, 2021 11:17 pm

PM BillyGoatii ( ALSO ON FACEBOOK Bill Ostovich SR ) Hes a Can Am owner and member here and Admin on the Can Am group I linked up there on Facebook he can help ya source all that, If not he will know where to send ya

This Person will be inValueable also (not a member here though YET) https://www.facebook.com/dave.ponczkowski

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Post by g3chevy / Mr Pontiac Tue Jun 29, 2021 11:17 pm

77camino wrote:G3gm, it’s great that you are going to save one of them. It’s a shame that they ever got in that condition because those were all ready being collected in the 80’s. In the mid 80’s I used to run into a guy at KC car shows that had collected several of them. Im sure that one of them was a trailer queen, but he had others that he would drive. I think he even started a registry, but unfortunately I have not seen him in years. Good luck and will look forward to seeing your progress.

My intent from the very beginning was to save both of these cars. But at some point you just have to be realistic. The "parts car" is really rough. I think we lost 50 pounds of the car unloading it just from rust scale falling off, along with the exhaust system lol. But regardless, the sunroof car will be brought back to its former glory. Just really frustrating that both of these cars ended up in this condition. But I am very grateful for the opportunity to restore one of these. Limey sent me a link to a Facebook group for Can Ams. I'll try to sign up on that site and see what I can learn. Nice to see that there are still a number of these cars around in very nice condition.
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Post by g3chevy / Mr Pontiac Tue Jun 29, 2021 11:18 pm

Limey SE wrote:PM BillyGoatii ( ALSO ON FACEBOOK Bill Ostovich SR )  Hes a Can Am owner and member here and Admin on the Can Am group I linked up there on Facebook he can help ya source all that, If not he will know where to send ya

This Person will be inValueable also (not a member here though YET) https://www.facebook.com/dave.ponczkowski

Awesome, thanks for the info Limey!
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Post by g3chevy / Mr Pontiac Wed Jun 30, 2021 7:39 pm

Was able to get a couple of miscellaneous things done today. Went to the DMV and got the title transferred into my name. Then I started pulling codes off of the engine block to figure out if it was the engine it was born with. Well after a lot of cleaning and wire brushing I was able to confirm its the original engine. The last 6 digits of the VIN were stamped on the front of the block exactly where Iggy mentioned it would be found as well as the engine code higher up on the block. This was "Y6" which indicates the 200 HP 4 Barrel motor with 8.0 to 1 compression as stated in the chart below courtesy of the link Iggy posted earlier. And I just received my factory Pontiac manuals today which is a 2 volume set and over 500 pages of pure reading bliss. Looked up the axle code in the book and it says the rear diff is an open gear with a 2.41 drive ratio. The Code "AA O" states in the manual that "AA" is 2.41 open and "O" is Oldsmobile as the manufacturer. So these are bolt in axles which is good. Not what I was expecting. The decal inside the trunk says it should have positraction. Now I have to see what the parts car has in it. Lots of stuff learned today for sure. Can Am fever continues...

WALLACERACING.COM
1977 400 200 HP Y6 A 8.0 112 6X 1-4 17057266 Firebird Block Casting # 500557

ENGINE VIN
1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build Engine11


ENGINE CODE
1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build Engine10


TRUNK DECAL
1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build 20210615


2 VOLUME GM SHOP MANUALs
1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build Img_2019


REAR DIFFERENTIAL CODES
1977 Pontiac Cam Am Build Img_2018
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Post by 73ss Wed Jun 30, 2021 8:33 pm

I have borrowed pontiac service manuals in the past for a bolt in axle Olds rear overhaul and for a steering box overhaul. Very detailed info. Much more than the chevy service manual. I've wondered why they were so much more detailed over the chevy manuals.
My 73 came factory with a bolt in axle olds rear. I swapped it out years ago for a c clip type. Not knowing any better. I completely overhauled the olds rear 2 years ago. It looks to be a more robust rear over the "C" clip type. More robust welds, a deeper rear cover to hold more oil. Just a better built unit all around. It was a little tricky finding the correct axle seals for it but rock auto had them.
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Post by g3chevy / Mr Pontiac Thu Jul 01, 2021 11:56 pm

73ss wrote:I have borrowed pontiac service manuals in the past for a bolt in axle Olds rear overhaul and for a steering box overhaul. Very detailed info. Much more than the chevy service manual. I've wondered why they were so much more detailed over the chevy manuals.
My 73 came factory with a bolt in axle olds rear. I swapped it out years ago for a c clip type. Not knowing any better. I completely overhauled the olds rear 2 years ago. It looks to be a more robust rear over the "C" clip type. More robust welds, a deeper rear cover to hold more oil. Just a better built unit all around. It was a little tricky finding the correct axle seals for it but rock auto had them.

Yeah, these Pontiac manuals have tons of detailed information in them. Almost twice as many pages at the Chevrolet manuals I have. I read a couple articles that stated these Olds rear ends are as tough as the 12 bolt rear ends. Not sure if that's true but I've sold a couple of these units to guys that race for a hobby. They seem to like them.
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Post by 73ss Fri Jul 02, 2021 8:35 am

I don't think it would be as strong as a 12 bolt as it takes the same 8.5 carrier as the C clip type. At least mine did. I swapped the posi carrier from my C clip rear over to the olds axle. The axels are different, slightly larger in diameter from the spline out and no spot for a C clip.
The bad news with your rear if it is a 2.41 posi, It's virtually useless for a performance gear. I believe 2.56 was the cut off point. The carrier is slightly larger in diameter to accommodate the extra teeth of the 2.41/2.56 gears. In other words a 3.73 or other performance gear will not fit the 2.41 carrier.
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Post by g3chevy / Mr Pontiac Fri Jul 02, 2021 9:55 am

Good info. I'll keep this in mind when I rebuild the rear end somewhere down the road. So I'm guessing I'll need a new carrier unit (posi of course) to get better gears?
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