Malaise Era Cars Gaining Ground

Here's a great article from Hagerty on our vehicles.

https://www.hagerty.com/media/market-trends/5-affordable-classics-that-ended-2022-on-a-high/?utm_source=SFMC&utm_medium=email&utm_content=MED_UN_NA_EML_UN_WeekendRoadTrip&hashed_email=a2882ddef49dbd17d42878b67130780b1a504116fbe68c30ae5d97e8803bc99d

1973–1976 Chevrolet Chevelle Laguna Type S-3 +40 percent

That is my son that wrote that article (and many others)! A Dad has got to have his moment!

I think there may be certain parts of the country where interest in growing...just don't see it here in MN.  And, it's not like people in this state don't appreciate classic cars...we host two of the largest street rod and muscle car shows in the nation during the summer.  For whatever reason, this generation of A-bodies just doesn't generate much of an appreciation. Sure, you'll get the nods of approval and compliments along with "I had one of those back in the day" remarks...but, it stops there and nobody seems to want to acquire another one.

Iggy wrote:That is my son that wrote that article (and many others)!  A Dad has got to have his moment!

So glad your son is at Hagerty keeping us G3 folks on the radar!

Mcarlo77 wrote:I think there may be certain parts of the country where interest in growing...just don't see it here in MN.  And, it's not like people in this state don't appreciate classic cars...we host two of the largest street rod and muscle car shows in the nation during the summer.  For whatever reason, this generation of A-bodies just doesn't generate much of an appreciation.  Sure, you'll get the nods of approval and compliments along with "I had one of those back in the day" remarks...but, it stops there and nobody seems to want to acquire another one.  

I agree. I normally get the “nice car” or “my dad-uncle-neighbor had one just like that” and then they move on.

As I mentioned in a different thread, I have noted a definite increase in comments and also attempts to buy my Chevelle in the past 5 years. Actually I think the fact that it is a sedan makes it more appealing to people who don't want a racer type car. On the East Coast it is a different environment than for points west though. I have even had a few mid aged women comment about it.

Iggy wrote:That is my son that wrote that article (and many others)!  A Dad has got to have his moment!

Glad he gave you "bragging rights" as my Dad used to say..

I took my daily driver to a car show for the first time this past weekend.

To set the scene: Chemical Guys had a grand opening celebration for their new facility (they call it a 'shop' but it's huge) in Torrance, CA, premiering their first Rides & Coffee Car Show. I wanted to bring my 1968 Cadillac hearse but it was raining which continued all day, so I brought my Monte Carlo just for kicks. The show was informal; open to all makes, models, years, etc., and no judges or trophies, pretty much just show up and hang out. I estimate about 90% were tuner cars and new muscle like the modern Chargers, Camaros, Challengers, etc. There was, of course, one obligatory '65 Mustang and one obligatory '56 Chevy. Mind you, I don't dislike those cars but I see them at every car show and cruise night. I gravitate to cars you rarely or never see. For instance, at this show, someone brought a restored 1970 Honda N600; you think we have trouble finding parts for our cars? There was only one other 73-77 GM; a 1977 Monte Carlo that looked like a low-budget low-rider. There was one G4 Skylark with an LS engine swap.

I got lots of the "my uncle/neighbor's dad had one of these…" comments and one guy said he had a '73 Monte Carlo back in the day. He says he misses it now. They all agreed these were nice cars but under powered. I said how even in Kommiefornia, you can drop a powerful non-emission engine into a pre-76 car or do an LS swap if you're ambitious. The older (boomer/gen x) guys showed more interest than anyone else. One kid (probably 22 year-old) was shocked that power windows existed in the 1970's. I had to school him that power windows existed as early as the 1930's and were hydraulic, and power locks were vacuum operated. The look on his face was worth the trip.

My assessment from the reactions is most modern gearheads want easy. They want it done or mostly done. If it's carburated, they want it turnkey. If it's been upgraded with an LS engine, they're eager to reprogram the computer settings for more power. I can't says I blame them. The first thing I did to my Monte Carlo when I got her was to replace the 2-barrel carb/intake with a 4-barrel setup from a wrecking yard, and convert the factory single exhaust to dual; more power. I have refined my priorities and goals as the decades and miles have rolled by and I think today's young firebrands will too as they mature.

zucchi wrote:I took my daily driver to a car show for the first time this past weekend.

To set the scene: Chemical Guys had a grand opening celebration for their new facility (they call it a 'shop' but it's huge) in Torrance, CA, premiering their first Rides & Coffee Car Show. I wanted to bring my 1968 Cadillac hearse but it was raining which continued all day, so I brought my Monte Carlo just for kicks. The show was informal; open to all makes, models, years, etc., and no judges or trophies, pretty much just show up and hang out. I estimate about 90% were tuner cars and new muscle like the modern Chargers, Camaros, Challengers, etc. There was, of course, one obligatory '65 Mustang and one obligatory '56 Chevy. Mind you, I don't dislike those cars but I see them at every car show and cruise night. I gravitate to cars you rarely or never see. For instance, at this show, someone brought a restored 1970 Honda N600; you think we have trouble finding parts for our cars? There was only one other 73-77 GM; a 1977 Monte Carlo that looked like a low-budget low-rider. There was one G4 Skylark with an LS engine swap.

I got lots of the "my uncle/neighbor's dad had one of these…" comments and one guy said he had a '73 Monte Carlo back in the day. He says he misses it now. They all agreed these were nice cars but under powered. I said how even in Kommiefornia, you can drop a powerful non-emission engine into a pre-76 car or do an LS swap if you're ambitious. The older (boomer/gen x) guys showed more interest than anyone else. One kid (probably 22 year-old) was shocked that power windows existed in the 1970's. I had to school him that power windows existed as early as the 1930's and were hydraulic, and power locks were vacuum operated. The look on his face was worth the trip.

My assessment from the reactions is most modern gearheads want easy. They want it done or mostly done. If it's carburated, they want it turnkey. If it's been upgraded with an LS engine, they're eager to reprogram the computer settings for more power. I can't says I blame them. The first thing I did to my Monte Carlo when I got her was to replace the 2-barrel carb/intake with a 4-barrel setup from a wrecking yard, and convert the factory single exhaust to dual; more power. I have refined my priorities and goals as the decades and miles have rolled by and I think today's young firebrands will too as they mature.

THIS. The Cars & Coffee scene in NE Florida is the same way.....bunch of kids with new cars and a few obligatory "beach boys and lawn chairs" staples. I'm 36 and most guys my age or younger seem to be the "LS Swap" or "Crate Motor" type if they have any interest in old cars at all....easy street, order it new online stuff with no attention paid to originality or sourcing used/harder to find parts. The local pick-a-part has a '74 L82/4 spd Corvette and a '72 350-4 Monte Carlo and after over a month in the yard BOTH those engines are still in the cars. The plant in the Monte was a clean unit that barred over nicely and had the 993 heads....would have likely run. Guys just don't want to get into a rebuild of any sort I guess...and at $500+ a pop for an engine assembly by the time you add core charge and taxes, I couldn't justify picking them up myself as spares.

Let me start by saying I like all cars...well...most. Anyway.... (my car is LS swapped by ME....in a two car garage "figuring it out".) I digress......
HERE.
We have Cars & Coffee as well. Weather is not "nice" enough to start having them yet.
But , as I recall from last year....there is about a 500- 1000 cars that show up based on different venues around town. Challengers (too many) ....of every color ( the owners dont know where the gas cap is located) . A ton of Mustangs that are loud for the "kids" ...they removed the muflfers! C8s...which is no longer a "Corvette". They quit making Corvettes over a decade ago ( my opinion). And a BUNCH of the newer Camaros. I call these the usual suspects and cars I can see in the Wal-mart parking lot....if I go there! Ton of tuner cars.....imports. All these cars mentioned ....not much work is being done by the owner outside of applying Armour All.

I know this all sounds pretty cynical!

It's really hard to find and talk to guys that REALLY do all their own work.

I understand the "generational" shift and all. I GET IT!!! And they too are keeping the "car" culture alive....but in a different way.

When I go...I too only target the " 1-offs".....the guys who "dared " to be different and take on a car that access to parts is a challenge and they are a constant search to get those hard to find parts.


Usually , mine is the only G3 there. And when someone does stop and pay attention to all the work....its appreciated.
I usually have a "scrap" book with pictures of all my work there for people to thumb through.... and most thumbing through...dont get it.
But , there is only a few people who can truly understand the amount to work that has taken place to do true body-of- frame.
One time , I had an owner of a mid-sixties Chevelle ( his was nice...but I doubt if the guy could use a screwdriver) asked me why would I do a body -off to " that " car........my reply.....because IT'S not a mid-sixties Chevelle!!
Not the real reason....but you guys get what I'm sayin'....

impalamonte wrote:One time , I had an owner of a mid-sixties Chevelle ( his was nice...but I doubt if the guy could use a screwdriver)  asked me why would I do a body -off to " that " car........my reply.....because IT'S not a mid-sixties Chevelle!!
Not the real reason....but you guys get what I'm sayin'....

Totally. The first engine I built for my Monte Carlo back in the mid-1980s was a 4-bolt main 350 with an LT1 cam, tricked out double-hump fuelie heads, Edlbrock manifold, etc. Some guys asked why I would put it in "that" car rather than a Vette or Camaro. My answer to them at that time, "Your question answers itself. Vettes and Camaros have been done to death; I've never seen a built up '74 Monte Carlo." At the risk of being redundant, that was the mid-1980s.

Your comments about owners not knowing how to turn a wrench reminded me of a guy at a car show who owned a '65 or so Shelby Mustang. He was part of a group of Ford club members from one of the wealthier communities in the Twin Cities. I was standing there admiring their fully restored (or, excellent original) cars while a couple guys came up to him and asked some basic questions about his car. He tried to answer them, but it was obvious he had no idea about the workings of the car. From his manner of dress, I could only assume he just opened his wallet and had someone else do the work and maintenance on it. I lost all respect at that point. Same with those guys who buy their late model "muscle" cars and show them.

impalamonte wrote:Let me start by saying I like all cars...well...most. Anyway.... (my car is LS swapped by ME....in a two car garage "figuring it out".) I digress......
HERE.
We have Cars & Coffee as well. Weather is not "nice" enough to start having them yet.
But ,  as I recall from last year....there is about a 500- 1000 cars that show up based on different venues around town. Challengers (too many) ....of every color ( the owners dont know where the gas cap is located) . A ton of Mustangs that are loud for the "kids" ...they removed the muflfers!  C8s...which is no longer a "Corvette". They quit making Corvettes over a decade ago ( my opinion). And a BUNCH of the newer Camaros. I call these the usual suspects and cars I can see in the Wal-mart parking lot....if I go there! Ton of tuner cars.....imports. All these cars mentioned ....not much work is being done by the owner outside of applying Armour All.

I know this all sounds pretty cynical!

It's really hard to find and talk to guys that REALLY do all their own work.

I understand the "generational" shift and all. I GET IT!!! And they too are keeping the "car" culture alive....but in a different way.
 
When I go...I too only target the " 1-offs".....the guys who "dared " to be different and take on a car that access to parts is a challenge and they are a constant search to get those hard to find parts.


Usually , mine is the only G3 there. And when someone does stop and pay attention to all the work....its appreciated.
I usually have a "scrap" book with pictures of all my work there for people to thumb through.... and most thumbing through...dont get it.
But , there is only a few people who can truly understand the amount to work that has taken place to do true body-of- frame.
One time , I had an owner of a mid-sixties Chevelle ( his was nice...but I doubt if the guy could use a screwdriver)  asked me why would I do a body -off to " that " car........my reply.....because IT'S not a mid-sixties Chevelle!!
Not the real reason....but you guys get what I'm sayin'....

Mark, I think you are spot on. The group of guys I go to shows with do almost all their own work. So I can actually relate to them lol. Most of the car shows we go to are 80's and older only vehicles so that limits the new "store bought" muscle cars. But even then when you strike up a conversation with the guy who pulls in with a really nice 57 he tells you he just bought it at auction a few months ago. So there is no sweat equity in their vehicle by them. Usually those conversations are pretty short. But I have seen an increase in interest in our vehicles in the past couple of years. I'm a member of a G Body forum and one of the other members posted a pic of my Laguna on that site from a car show we were both at. Most had no idea what it was but they were intrigued by the fact it was used in NASCAR back in the day.
https://gbodyforum.com/threads/seans-78-camaro-z28.63930/page-24

Another thing I've noticed is there are more people my age that now are in a financial position to buy the cars they used to drive back in high school. So I believe that's what Hagerty is seeing with their stats in the policies they write. So values are slowly moving up which makes sense.

(Quote): Another thing I've noticed is there are more people my age that now are in a financial position to buy the cars they used to drive back in high school. So I believe that's what Hagerty is seeing with their stats in the policies they write. So values are slowly moving up which makes sense.

I agree that could be what's driving the values on the restored and/or excellent originals. But, I do believe that still leaves the common drivers or amateur-restored vehicles behind and of little interest because people just don't see the value in putting in the time and money.

Mcarlo77 wrote:(Quote):  Another thing I've noticed is there are more people my age that now are in a financial position to buy the cars they used to drive back in high school. So I believe that's what Hagerty is seeing with their stats in the policies they write. So values are slowly moving up which makes sense.

I agree that could be what's driving the values on the restored and/or excellent originals.  But, I do believe that still leaves the common drivers or amateur-restored vehicles behind and of little interest because people just don't see the value in putting in the time and money.

I have a clean stock sedan and Hagerty valued it in the mid teens so I think anything G3 that looks nice and runs well is rising in value, not just restored models or specialty models like the Laguna or big blocks. Yes I have replaced most engine bay parts (other than the small block) as well as the brakes but Hagerty doesn't know that, other than the car is running. I am getting frequent buy offers much more than in the past.

One of the things to remember is that the rarer or marquee cars are not driven on the streets. If a 1970 restored Chevelle showed up at the grocery store it would be stolen before long. So these are the oldest cars that people see that don't look like current models. But they have power steering and front disc brakes and people can easily install power windows if they didn't come stock. Many have A/C also. Even the G cars have enough of a downsized current look that people don't turn their heads for them where I am.

I do not think most "car buffs" appreciate the design improvements that went into these cars. Both front and rear suspension designs were a major leap, even if they did steal the front suspension from the C2-C3 Vettes. They ride smooth and are quite inside had more comfortable seats and I could go on! The only downfall was the smog engines of that era that plagued all autos, even the coveted Corvette! However, some of us have been improving the engines since those cars came out and made them fun to drive even back in the mid to late 1970's!

The 1973-1977 Monte Carlo has always been my favorite car followed very closely by the 1975 Laguna Type S-3, my wife still raves about the 1977 Monte Carlo we had when we got married, put over 250,000 miles on that car and Michigan salt claimed it by 1990, Firethorn Red Landau. I bought that car in 1979 from the company my father worked for, it was my dad's company car and he had 100,000 miles on it in 2 years and they replaced it with a 1979 Impala wagon and we had the first opportunity to purchase it! First thing I did was put in a new cam, intake and exhaust and it really made a difference! Learned how to rebuild a Quadrajet due to "gasahol" and still like no alcohol fuel!

I have a different POV on the buyers of fully restored G3s or even G2s. To be honest none of us are going to buy those so it's good that there are people out there willing to buy a trinket. It can only benefit us as it raises prices and it attracts more attention from parts makers. I am quite bullish with respect to the G3s for the reasons I mentioned above. Speaking for myself the only 2 later cars that I think are any good are the Buick Grand National and the mid 90s Impala SS. Other than that there are only truck models that have some worth. Increasingly people see our cars as Classics.

Iggy wrote:I do not think most "car buffs" appreciate the design improvements that went into these cars.  Both front and rear suspension designs were a major leap, even if they did steal the front suspension from the C2-C3 Vettes.  They ride smooth and are quite inside had more comfortable seats and I could go on!  The only downfall was the smog engines of that era that plagued all autos, even the coveted Corvette!  However, some of us have been improving the engines since those cars came out and made them fun to drive even back in the mid to late 1970's!

The 1973-1977 Monte Carlo has always been my favorite car followed very closely by the 1975 Laguna Type S-3, my wife still raves about the 1977 Monte Carlo we had when we got married, put over 250,000 miles on that car and Michigan salt claimed it by 1990, Firethorn Red Landau.  I bought that car in 1979 from the company my father worked for, it was my dad's company car and he had 100,000 miles on it in 2 years and they replaced it with a 1979 Impala wagon and we had the first opportunity to purchase it!  First thing I did was put in a new cam, intake and exhaust and it really made a difference!  Learned how to rebuild a Quadrajet due to "gasahol" and still like no alcohol fuel!

I agree with you, but one minor point. The front suspension on the G3s was shared with the Gen 2 Camaros, not the Corvettes. It was better than the C2/C3 front suspension anyway. I think another drawback for G3s is the big bumpers. The 1972 Chevelles was the last of the form fitting bumpers and the end of the era when stylist had supreme reign. It seems a lot of people turn their noses up these big bumper cars.

My Malibu was my Dad's daily driver and it was the most mechanically solid car in our family ever. Until I opened up the engine this year, it hadn't even had a valve cover off. Other than the alternator and radiator (due to corrosion), nothing else mechanical has ever needed to be replaced.

76 Malibu wrote:

 I think another drawback for G3s is the big bumpers.  The 1972 Chevelles was the last of the form fitting bumpers and the end of the era when stylist had supreme reign.  It seems a lot of people turn their noses up these big bumper cars.
.

That would be ironic since I have seen all kinds of modern cars with cracked or scraped front end panels. Of course these odd shaped body parts are super expensive to replace. I get it that their front ends are supposed to be collapsible in the event of front end collision but many times there are minor accidents far short of collision. The reduced bumper collision standard put into effect in the 80s is a joke. My Chevelle bumpers have repeatedly saved me repair bills. I guess I'm old fashioned because I love the chrome. in any event my experience is that opinions of these G3 cars are rapidly changing in a positive direction among the general public, I can understand classic car enthusiasts to value pure styling most since their cars are almost never out in the street.

76Chevelle2Tone wrote:

That would be ironic since I have seen all kinds of modern cars with cracked or scraped front end panels. Of course these odd shaped body parts are super expensive to replace. I get it that their front ends are supposed to be collapsible in the event of front end collision but many times there are minor accidents far short of collision. The reduced bumper collision standard put into effect in the 80s is a joke. My Chevelle bumpers have repeatedly saved me repair bills. I guess I'm old fashioned because I love the chrome. in any event my experience is that opinions of these G3 cars is rapidly changing in a positive direction among the general public, I can understand classic car enthusiasts to value pure styling most since their cars are almost never out in the street.

I am not saying I think they are bad, in fact I agree they were the best at protecting the  car. However, for years the big bumper cars were looked down upon by many, as in it was seen as a disadvantage to the "car collector" community because it ended the classic uninhibited styling.  For a long time, it seemed all the big bumper cars were looked down upon,  but now they are so far removed from new cars, people don't seem to dislike them as much. I personally always like them. I never understood why the early Chevelle guys had to hate on the G3s so much. I always liked both, appreciate each for their positive attributes.

I can certainly understand why the earlier G2s of the 60s and early 70s were viewed as the standard since their performance was not encumbered with the pollution control modifications and the safety mods of the 70s. I myself like the 68s to 71s the most just in terms of styling. The G3s were viewed at the time as moving towards the family type car that the G2s were deliberately marketed against. Even the Nova got upscale interiors with the Concours model. The sad aspect is that Chevy totally blew it with respect to marketing the great Laguna which had performance with style and never recovered its dominance. The Grand National made Buick a leader in the 80s over Chevy.

These days though the general public (at least along the East Coast) is comparing the G3s against their own pod style cars not earlier models that are in the museum so to speak.

76Chevelle2Tone wrote:

76 Malibu wrote:

 I think another drawback for G3s is the big bumpers.  The 1972 Chevelles was the last of the form fitting bumpers and the end of the era when stylist had supreme reign.  It seems a lot of people turn their noses up these big bumper cars.
.

That would be ironic since I have seen all kinds of modern cars with cracked or scraped front end panels. Of course these odd shaped body parts are super expensive to replace. … My Chevelle bumpers have repeatedly saved me repair bills.

I can attest to that. Most recently, about six-years ago on one of my drives home from work, I was in the center lane of a three-lane boulevard approaching an area of road construction. Over the previous two-blocks, there were signs notifying drivers that the right-lane will be merging into the center lane. As traffic approaches the point of no return, some impatient refugee from a brain trust who didn't understand zippering (he likely felt he was too important to adhere to the rules of the road but I wasn't on the distribution list of that memo) forced his way into my lane in front of me. He had some late model plastic car. I blew the horn, he kept forcing the merge, I stopped, he kept going, scraped his rear quarter panel against my bumper and hooked the edge of his rear plastic bumper to the edge of my steel front bumper. His bumper was ripped off his plastic sedan. My bumper showed absolutely no sign of damage. The insurance companies agreed that it was the other guy's fault; per the vehicle code, the driver who's merging/changing lanes must be certain that it is safe to do so. He didn't.

I've been rear-ended a few times, once really hard. If I had a '73 Monte Carlo, my back end would have been badly damaged by that hard collision. As it was, my bumper was dented and the fiberglass panel was cracked.

I may be in the minority but I really like the big bumpers on my Monte Carlo. I refer to them as my urban assault tank bumpers. They really come in handy when I parallel park and some inconsiderate person/people parks really close in front/behind me to where I cannot get out of the parking space. I gently kiss their bumper with my bumper then slowly increase engine output to push the offensive vehicle far enough to make room for me to get out.

Haha too funny. Well it's the difference between looking at a car at a show or actually driving one. If the 5 mph bumpers were big wads of rubber I could understand the complaints a bit more but what kinds of car enthusiasts complain about chrome?

And speaking of driving, many of the earlier Chevys now have aftermarket PS/PB/AC and modified steering!

Ha Zucchi! I Like your style!

g3chevy / Mr Pontiac wrote:Ha Zucchi! I Like your style!

Thanks

Mind you, I was raised with values, ethics and courtesy. For instance, when I parallel park, I make sure I don't park too close to another car or, if I'm near an intersection, I park right up against the red-zone so as to leave plenty of space for other cars. While driving, when I see or even suspect a driver want's to merge into my lane, I let-off the accelerator so as to let them in. Of course, my gut reaction is to mash the accelerator to pass them so they have to merge behind me but I take a deep breath, remind myself that I'm giving them way too much power over me which they don't deserve. Not to mention it's that sort of act that can escalate an annoyance into an incident… Let's just say it really helps to have a dash cam. There isn't one day that goes by where I don't see an outrageous move by some driver, shake my head and ponder, "was that necessary? Was that maneuver worth risking a collision?"

A few times while sitting in heavy traffic, I wondered how many cars would one need to pass just to shave one-minute off this drive. I won't bore you with the calculations but the numbers I came up with were, depending on average speed, anywhere from 93 to 137 cars. Upon exiting the freeway, whatever time you thought you saved is spent sitting at the light at the end of the off-ramp. That really helped give me perspective on the futility of trying to find the "fastest" lane during rush-hour traffic.

Well, enough of that. This thread's about the growing popularity of G3 cars, not driving philosophy. Sorry about going off on that extended tangent.

By the way, am I the only one who noticed that the front of the '73-'74 Laguna looks like the front of the Ford Mustang II?