73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

by marks454ss Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:14 pm

Houston we have a problem. While reinstalling my steering column I pushed the pot joint cover toward the firewall onto the splines of the column. I now have a lot of movement up and down and side to side at the pot joint. I called Kevin (clanceman427) and he tells me his 73 is tight and I really didn't check it for looseness before removing it. Can somebody give me the measurement from the outside tip of the pot joint to the outside edge of the stationary half of the rag joint (the half that is part of the shaft)? I have about 19-3/4" collapsed sitting on the table with no looseness other than what is to be expected at the cross pin and about 20-1/2" installed in the car. I'm thinking the car was front end wrecked and the shaft has been collapsed and reused and the pin is coming out of the pot joint. I say this due to the fact that at 0 on the wheels the pot joint bolt was installed horizontal with the ground at 12 o'clock instead of vertical on the engine side of the shaft at 9 o'clock which I believe is the correct orientation of the bolt.

by Joe73 Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:29 pm

If no one posts up by the time I get home Id be glad to help.

by Joe73 Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:48 pm

Btw, any idea if its different for manual steering? Thats how my car came. Or we can just measure and check.

by marks454ss Thu Jan 21, 2016 4:41 pm

I'm assuming the gearbox would be the same distance either way

by Joe73 Thu Jan 21, 2016 6:16 pm

mark, check your pm's

by Limey SE Thu Jan 21, 2016 6:20 pm

Mark what year did the colum com from for when I switched mine from a 73 I had to use my 77 Lower ( one with rag joint ) SO I am assuming since yours is a 73 you have to switch your lower arm from your original column to the new column you also have to switch the 73 plugs on the column from yours to the New one

by marks454ss Thu Jan 21, 2016 6:57 pm

The column came from the 73 parts car

by 73ss Thu Jan 21, 2016 7:50 pm

I have my lower shaft removed and I just measured it. 18 3/16" from the end of lower rag joint flange (As you described) to the end of the shaft that goes in the pot joint. I currently have mine dis-assenbled. No pot joint on the end of the shaft. I think that the wire clip that holds the seal in holds the whole thing together tight. Is you'r clip fully seated? Maybe the "U" shaped spring clip inside the pot joint has become dislodged?

On another note be very careful with the seal. I tore mine last year and am having one hell of a time finding a replacement. I picked one up from the parts place and it is too small in diameter. The wire clip will not hold it in place. I am thinking of maybe cemeting it onto the top of the old seal. I cut the old boot off down to the round part that fits in the joint. I'm still trying to figure out something.

I have a previous post with some links.

The seal looks the same as what was used on '73-'87 CK trucks. LMC does not have one. They sell new complete shafts with u-joints.

by marks454ss Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:28 pm

I got up with Joe73 and his is out of the car as well. His measures 19 3/4 with the pot joint pushed all the way in same as mine.

However when he started looking up part numbers for me in his GM parts manual there are different numbers for the shaft depending on whether you have a big or small block car same for the rag joint. I'm picking up my new gearbox from Napa tomorrow and will start from there and try to get this thing back together the way it's supposed to be. Wink

by marks454ss Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:47 pm

Have you looked at this?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1968-77-Chevrolet-Chevelle-Steering-Column-Intermediate-Shaft-Seal-/270538126411

73ss wrote:I have my lower shaft removed and I just measured it. 18 3/16" from the end of lower rag joint flange (As you described) to the end of the shaft that goes in the pot joint. I currently have mine dis-assenbled. No pot joint on the end of the shaft. I think that the wire clip that holds the seal in holds the whole thing together tight. Is you'r clip fully seated? Maybe the "U" shaped spring clip inside the pot joint has become dislodged?

On another note be very careful with the seal. I tore mine last year and am having one hell of a time finding a replacement. I picked one up from the parts place and it is too small in diameter. The wire clip will not hold it in place. I am thinking of maybe cemeting it onto the top of the old seal. I cut the old boot off down to the round part that fits in the joint. I'm still trying to figure out something.

I have a previous post with some links.

The seal looks the same as what was used on '73-'87 CK trucks. LMC does not have one. They sell new complete shafts with u-joints.

by 73ss Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:29 pm

[quote="marks454ss"]Have you looked at this?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1968-77-Chevrolet-Chevelle-Steering-Column-Intermediate-Shaft-Seal-/270538126411

Thanks for the response!! Yes, I bought that seal from them. I looks as if it would work other than the diameter. It is 2".

Mine is 2 1/4". Retaining clip wont hold it and doesn't totally seal. 2 inch diameter is most likely previous gen.

by 73ss Sun Feb 07, 2016 2:37 pm

Figured I would post some pics before I put it back on the car. I'm measuring 19 3/8" fully collapsed & 20 13/16" fully extended.(Can't take a pic and hold tape at same time) This was originally a small block car which is why my numbers differ? It has a BB now so I wonder why 2 different shafts unless it had something to do with exhaust manifold clearance. I have headers. The seal is from a jeep. There is no direct replacement seal for this that I can find. The seals that are available are 2" diameter. This is 2 1/4". This appears to be a non-serviceable item which is why I can't find any parts #'s, other than the shaft itself. This thing is nothing but a massive headache. Those of you doing any work on the shaft be careful of the seal!!!!!!!!!!!!
I do not know but I would guess '73 is the first year for the plastic injected shaft??

73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question DSCF1978_zps0sfzrllb

73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question DSCF1978_zps0sfzrllb

73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question DSCF1980_zps5r9zqrtt

by zucchi Tue Dec 13, 2022 1:06 pm

I had the same issue regarding the boot when I needed to rebuild the intermediate steering shaft coupling joint; the boot/seal had literally disintegrated over the past 48 years. Before getting into my solution, please permit me to address some of the issues mentioned earlier in this thread.

I found it odd that the 1974 Chevrolet service manual had detailed instructions on how to disassemble and reassemble the coupling joint yet the parts manuals didn't have a part number for the boot on anything later than 1972. I further discovered that by 1977, Chevrolet had removed the instructions from their service manual implying it wasn't serviceable and that it had to be replaced as an assembly. Like you, I bought a reproduction boot and discovered its diameter was too small. This video was my solution:

For proper disassembly (and to do the show car quality restoration), I suggest you check out this guy:

To do this right, you really need a press. One guy on YouTube simply stretched the boot over the pressed in rod/pin using a screwdriver; made me cringe just watching that as I expected it to tear at any moment. Another guy hammered the rod/pin out; I stopped watching when he started hammering so I don't know how or if he got it back in.

Anyway, hope this helps.

by g3chevy / Mr Pontiac Wed Dec 14, 2022 2:06 pm

Great video. Just subscribed. Just like Limey mentioned above, the 77 intermediate shaft is different from the 73-76 design as me and Hawk03 found out when I sent him the wrong (73-76) steering column for his build. We made a hybrid shaft using the upper for a 73-6 and lower for a 77. If I remember correctly, the rubber seal from a 2nd gen F Body is the same as the 77 seal. Also, when I switched out one of these in the past, I remember just sliding the upper part of the shaft out of the lower part and slid the old seal off and new one on without having to press out the cross pin. Regardless, I really like these "how to" videos for our vehicles. Hopefully these generate more interest in our hobby.

by zucchi Thu Dec 15, 2022 10:28 am

g3chevy / Mr Pontiac wrote:Great video. Just subscribed.

Thanks, I'm flattered.

g3chevy / Mr Pontiac wrote:Also, when I switched out one of these in the past, I remember just sliding the upper part of the shaft out of the lower part…

For these cars, it's always been my understanding that there's supposed to be a pair of injected plastic shear pins preventing movement between the two pieces that makeup the shaft…

73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question Dscf1910

Unless I'm misunderstanding, what you described causes me concern that those pins had been sheared due to a collision or someone in the past not paying attention to the warning in the service manual and using a hammer longitudinally on that shaft. I hope that's not the case.

by impalamonte Thu Dec 15, 2022 11:56 am

Is there a source site / manufacturer from which we can purchase the " boot / seal" ?

by g3chevy / Mr Pontiac Thu Dec 15, 2022 11:57 am

zucchi wrote:
g3chevy / Mr Pontiac wrote:Also, when I switched out one of these in the past, I remember just sliding the upper part of the shaft out of the lower part…

For these cars, it's always been my understanding that there's supposed to be a pair of injected plastic shear pins preventing movement between the two pieces that makeup the shaft…

Unless I'm misunderstanding, what you described causes me concern that those pins had been sheared due to a collision or someone in the past not paying attention to the warning in the service manual and using a hammer longitudinally on that shaft. I hope that's not the case.

Yes, I think that is the same process GM uses to "lock in" universal joints. Some of the intermediate shafts have them and some don't. When I've melted them out to disassemble the shaft, there is a "load spring" (highlighted in pic below) that keeps tension between both the upper and lower part of the shaft. So even with these nylon plugs missing it still seems to function as it should. Maybe these nylon plugs were used to keep the intermediate shaft from expanding or contracting in length during production line assembly? Here's a pic of a 73-76 upper shaft installed on a 77 lower shaft (left side of pic) and the right side is the 77 upper and 73-76 lower. This is the conversion I did for Hawk03 here on the forum. Notice no holes on the 77 lower shaft for the nylon plugs.

73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question Interm11

by g3chevy / Mr Pontiac Thu Dec 15, 2022 11:59 am

impalamonte wrote:Is there a source site / manufacturer from which we can purchase the " boot / seal" ?

Hey Mark, I believe this will work. But I doubt this is correct for a 77 year model since the shaft is a different design.

https://www.opgi.com/chassis-suspension/steering-components/1968-77-intermediate-steering-shaft-seal/boot-intermediate-steering-shaft-1968-77-a-body-g240482.html

by zucchi Thu Dec 15, 2022 12:18 pm

impalamonte wrote:Is there a source site / manufacturer from which we can purchase the " boot / seal" ?

I got mine from evilBay:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/194457164541?

by zucchi Thu Dec 15, 2022 12:29 pm

g3chevy / Mr Pontiac wrote:Maybe these nylon plugs were used to keep the intermediate shaft from expanding or contracting in length during production line assembly?

Perhaps. However, the 1974 service manual talks about adjusting the steering coupling (a.k.a. rag-joint) by moving the shaft toward or away from the steering gear box ever so slightly. That would be impossible to do with a shaft that's not rigid. Nevertheless, I see what you mean with the 1977 shaft.

by 73ss Thu Dec 15, 2022 6:23 pm

" For these cars, it's always been my understanding that there's supposed to be a pair of injected plastic shear pins preventing movement between the two pieces that makeup the shaft…

Unless I'm misunderstanding, what you described causes me concern that those pins had been sheared due to a collision or someone in the past not paying attention to the warning in the service manual and using a hammer longitudinally on that shaft. I hope that's not the case."

The pins are still kinda there where you have the red arrows. I'm not sure if they are actual pins, or just the opening where it was injected with plastic. The shaft is still solid, Although it probably has been compromised some. What had happened is things got a little toasty once when I was doing a cam break in. The additional heat from the high idle caused them to melt. I didn't know it was plastic until it started melting. My understanding is that the pins or the plastic would shear in the event of an accident allowing the column to collapse. GM's "energy absorbing" steering column that they touted back in the day.

As far as moving the shaft to adjust the rag joint, The pot joint allowed for some movement. In the 2 pictures I posted, One is with the pot joint pushed in, The other is extended. You can see where the rubber boot is stretched out where the assembly is extended.

by impalamonte Fri Dec 16, 2022 3:01 pm

Thanks guys....G3 Chevy , Zucchi

by Sponsored content

73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Mentioned this in the related thread

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question

Re: 73 Chevelle SS Intermediate shaft question